Stupid Question ¡¡

[Donatien]

HI EVERYONE ¡¡ I NEED YOUR HELP, I`M NEW PROGRAMMING, BUT I KNOW , AND I UNDERSTAND A LADDER PROGRAM , BUT I HAVE A PROBLEM, I DON`T KNOW WHAT IS THE BETTER OPTION TO THE FOLLOWING APLICATION: I HAVE A CONVEYOR, AND PACKAGES OF 12 BOOTLES GO THROUGH THE CONVEYOR TO BE LABELLED, I HAVE AN APLICATION LABEL MACHINE (THIS MACHINE THE ONLY THING THAT NEEDS FOR THE APLICATION OF THE LABEL IS A SIGNAL FROM A SENSOR ), BUT DUE TO THE CONDITIONS OF THE SYSTEM AND THE SPEED OF THE CONVEYOR, I NEED TO INSTALL 2 APLICATION LABELS MACHINES WORKING ""INTERMITENT IN THE CONVEYOR"", WITH ONLY ONE SENSOR TO START THE APLICATION OF BOTH MACHINES. ---------------------------------- ---L---------I----I-------------------CONVEYOR SENS 1 2 1.- FIRST APLICATION LABEL MACHINE 2.- SECOND APLICATION LABEL MACHINE L.- SENSOR ----- ----- CONVEYOR WITH THE PACKAGES OF BOOTLES THE QUESTION IS VERY SIMPLE, WHAT`S THE BETTER PROGRAM FOR THIS SIMPLE SECUENCE IF I NEED THAT BOTH APLICATION LABEL MACHINES WORK INTERMITENT IN THE CONVEYOR . I`M THINKING USE A PICO CONTROLLER FROM ALLEN BRADLEY , SO I CAN INTRODUCE A LADDER DIAGRAM. OR I HAVE A MICROLOGIX TOO THANKS IN ADVANCE FOR ANY REPLIES ¡¡¡¡

[Ken Moore]

Sometimes I'm a little slow, so let me say what I think you mean, then everyone will be working from the same page. This is the way I understand it. You have a conveyor feeding two lablers. The first bottle comes down the conveyor, makes a sensor, then is lablelled by machine #1. 2nd bottle comes down the conveyor, makes a sensor, then is lablelled by machine #2. You basically want to flip flop the " active" machine each cycle is that correct? Exactly how does the sensor work? Is there some type of timing between the sensor and the label machine, or does the machine have it's own sensor to detect a bottle is present? Edited March 17, 2005 by Ken Moore

[Donatien]

THANKS FOR YOUR HELP KEN: YES, I have a conveyor feeding two lablers. YES, The first bottle comes down the conveyor, makes a sensor, then is lablelled by machine #1. 2nd bottle comes down the conveyor, makes THE SAME sensor, then is lablelled by machine #2. You basically want to flip flop the " active" machine each cycle is that correct? YES , I SUPPOSE THAT I WANT Exactly how does the sensor work? Is there some type of timing between the sensor and the label machine, or does the machine have it's own sensor to detect a bottle is present? YES, EACH MACHINE HAS HIS OWN SENSOR TO DETECT A BOTTLE WITHOUT A TIMING , BUT THIS IS THE CASE WHEN THE MACHINE IS WORKING ALONE , IN THIS CASE (2 MACHINES)I WANT TO USE ONLY ONE SENSOR TO ACTIVATE THE SYSTEM. THANKS ¡¡

[Ken Moore]

I don't think this is going to be as easy as you think. On the labellers I've encountered the sensor location is key. It basically says part present, apply label. If you try to use one sensor and switch back and forth between machines. Timing becomes an issue. If machine #1 is active, the sensor is made and a label is applied at machine #1, you must now wait for the bottle to clear machine #2 before switching #2 to active. This must all happen before the next bottle makes the sensor. Do you have this much time between bottles? I doubt it. So...I think you will need a sensor for each machine, and a small plc to make the labellers skip every other bottle.

[Donatien]

SORRY KEN, YOU`RE RIGHT , I WAS THINKING THAT IT COULD BE EASY BUT I SEE THAT I DIDN`T HAVE A CLEAR IDEA ABOUT THIS .. ABOUT YOUR QUESTIONS Do you have this much time between bottles? NO I DON`T ,THE BOTTLES GO FAST BY THE CONVEYOR APROX 15 INCHES BETWEEN BOTTLES , APROX 5 SECONDS ONE OF THE OTHER ONE. ********* So...I think you will need a sensor for each machine, and a small plc to make the labellers skip every other bottle. YES I AGREE, BUT HOW CAN I DO THIS ?? IS IT DIFFICULT THE PROGRAM ?? I DON`T KNOW , BUT I WAS THINKING IN SOMETHING LIKE COUPLE AND ODD, DEPENDING THE VALUE THE LABEL MACHINE IS GOING TO APPLY THE LABEL. FOR EXAMPLE IF THE VALUE IS 1 OR 3 OR 5 OR 7 ETC , THE MACHINE #1 IS ACTIVE, IF THE VALUE IS 2, 4, 6, 8, ETC , MACHINE #2 IS ACTIVE, BUT I DON`T KNOW IF I NEED TO USE 1, 2, OR 3 SENSORS, OR IS THERE ANOTHER OPTION ?? THANKS FOR YOUR HELP AND TIME ¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡

[Ken Moore]

I don't think this is your best option, it may work but will not be reliable. What happens if for some reason, some how, a bottle is removed between machines 1 & 2. You will end up with a lot of bottles that have two labels or no label. I think the best solution would be to add an additional conveyor to feed the second machine, and use a PLC to divert the bottles down the two lines, they could merge back into one for packageing. Just a thought

[Donatien]

THANKS KEN, IM GOING TO DO SOME TESTS IN THIS APLICATION, BUT MAYBE THE BETER OPTION IS THE 2 LINES THANKS